law to meet with -- >> under u.s. law, to meet with members of the african national congress. so i had to go many times to switzerland, just to meet with anc leaders and supporters to help develop the solidarity movement, which we were mounting here in our own country. when i worked for congressman dellums, i have to say, ron dellums and bill gray, they led the fight for many, many years for sanctions to put this country on the right side of history. i remember ron introduced the sanctions bill, it must have been 12 times. and he would not waver. he kept going and kept going. finally, when president reagan vetoed it, the congress overrode that veto and put the united states on the right side of history. but still, the anc and president mandela were considered terrorists. and it wasn't until i was in south africa a few years ago that i learned of this and came back and then we started our efforts with homeland security and with the state department to get him removed from the terrorist list. and that was for his 90th birthday. >> this is a really important moment, this reagan -